Author Topic: jump3  (Read 606 times)

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dcco

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Re: jump3
« Reply #60 on: October 08, 2017, 08:34:57 PM »
would it be feasible to do something that "rounds" the button frame times into certain intervals? for instance, if you let go between 0-5ish frames it does jumps of a certain fixed height, and then like 6-8, etc? idk if that would fit your vision for the game design or w/e tho

aimaina

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Re: jump3
« Reply #61 on: October 08, 2017, 08:40:58 PM »
i think thats basically what cook suggested earlier..... i might try it out and see how it feels. im thinking ill probably keep the current system though & just design the levels so that you dont need to do jumps less than X frames (probably with X = 5, since that seems like a good balance between lenient for players & flexible for level design)

dcco

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Re: jump3
« Reply #62 on: October 08, 2017, 09:21:40 PM »
oh wait yeah somehow i didnt comprehend cook's suggestion even though it was basically mine lul

SquareWheel

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Re: jump3
« Reply #63 on: October 08, 2017, 09:57:44 PM »
ducko

SquareWheel

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Re: jump3
« Reply #64 on: October 08, 2017, 09:58:25 PM »
It was actually a pretty easy miss, but it felt good to say for old times' sake.

aimaina

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Re: jump3
« Reply #65 on: October 09, 2017, 02:34:32 AM »
the cook/ducko gambit is actually hard to implement....

i mean, if i wanted frame 1 to behave like frame 2, frame 3 to behave like frame 4, etc. that would probably be easy, just pretend the button is held down for one frame longer than it actually is

the problem is that because of the way jump heights are currently set, i actually want it to be the other way around: frame 2 behaves like frame 1, frame 4 behaves like frame 3, etc. & i dont think i can do that nicely since i cant know whether the button will be released on the next frame

vgperson

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Re: jump3
« Reply #66 on: October 09, 2017, 03:12:33 AM »
Maybe you could cheat a little and basically recalculate your position and speed as if the key had been released a frame earlier. That could get a little messy if the "real" movement makes you hit a spike, but I think it'd work?

aimaina

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Re: jump3
« Reply #67 on: October 09, 2017, 03:40:14 AM »
yeha thats what i tried for a while....

lets say the jump height is 6 and the gravity is 1, and releasing the key cuts vertical speed in half (with integer division), and the jump button is pressed on frame 0....

frame 0: vsp = 6, y = 6 (jump stuff happens after gravity in my code)

if the jump button is released on frame 1, first gravity happens (vsp = 5) and then the speed is cut in half (vsp = 2) and we get
frame 1: vsp = 2, y = 8
frame 2: vsp = 1, y = 9
total jump height = 9

but if the jump button is released on frame 2:
frame 1: vsp = 5, y = 11
frame 2: vsp = (4 div 2) = 2, y = 13
frame 3: vsp = 1, y = 14
total jump height = 14

suppose on frame 2, we recalculate vsp and y to match the first scenario. then first of all, vsp is cut from 5 to 1, which is a factor of 5 rather than 2 or 2.5, so the jump arc might look a bit less natural. but the real problem is that we have to drop from y = 11 to y = 9, so theres a weird 2 pixel backwards jump in position which will probably be noticeable..... so i think in general you cant do the recalculating thing without ruining the jump arc

sorry i mostly wrote this for myself to collect my thoughts but maybe its interesting

aimaina

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Re: jump3
« Reply #68 on: October 09, 2017, 03:49:46 AM »
something i found out is that if i lower the jump height by 3 pixels, then the game is beatable with 6-frame key release delay rather than 5-frame..... a few jumps are slightly harder with the lower height but others are easier..... im really unsure if i should change the jump height or not

juner

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Re: jump3
« Reply #69 on: October 09, 2017, 09:45:55 AM »
what about a key that can optionally be set to input a 1-frame jump?
kinda goes against having to master a single simple jump key that offers a lot of control though. and whether or not you'd need bindable keys for 2-frame, 3-frame inputs etc also for accessibility...

aimaina

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Re: jump3
« Reply #70 on: October 09, 2017, 02:38:53 PM »
i thought about that too..... it would be nice but it seems kinda overly complicated to me to have two jump buttons, especially since the way i do key config doesnt really support "optional" keys so everyone would have to set it.....

aimaina

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Re: jump3
« Reply #71 on: October 09, 2017, 09:14:19 PM »
i ended up implementing the shorthop button.... you can even customize the shorthop height.... :honeydew:

aimaina

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Re: jump3
« Reply #72 on: October 12, 2017, 03:18:07 AM »
in the wake of cute jump i wanted to make a more accessible hard platformer but all of my irl playtesters so far have found the training course overwhelming and struggled a lot with it. i feel like im just making a game with no audience again (except for vg)

i dont know how you even make easy platforming levels without them just being boring..... like 4 example

this jump from "climber" is pretty tough because you have to jump and curve over the circled spike with the right timing, so that you can double jump up to the block at the peak of your first jump. i could make it easier by removing the circled spike but then its completely boring..... you just hold left and stop at the right place

aimaina

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Re: jump3
« Reply #73 on: October 12, 2017, 03:21:57 AM »
wait i just actually did that jump instead of writing about it from memory and my description of how it works is completely wrong. lol well its still much more interesting with the circled spike so the point stands

vgperson

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Re: jump3
« Reply #74 on: October 12, 2017, 03:45:54 AM »
I think the super-general answer is "make movement fun"? Having technical variable jumping puzzles can be cool, but that alone is probably not that appealing to more casual players. I tend to picture easy platforming levels as having large open spaces, rather than being densely-packed with complicated jumps. Which is of course a bit tricky if you're doing single-screen levels.

Writing that made me realize Dustforce could be a pretty good reference; it has big sections where you get to slide and jump long distances and feel cool, while its hardest stages are packed with technical jumps.